Episode 4- Cracking the Myths of Job Search and Careers with the Career Sherpa, Hannah Morgan

Linda Heeler: 0:05

Welcome to Episode Four of the Normal Lies podcast. In this episode we talk to Job Search strategist Hannah Morgan. Hannah provides ambitious professionals with help and hope as they look for new opportunities and maneuver through today's unfamiliar job search process. She is a nationally recognized author and speaker on job search strategies, who was previously a LinkedIn top voice in Job Search and careers. She founded CareerSherpa.net to combine her career experience with her love of writing, speaking and social media. Hannah is a regular contributor to US News and World Report and has been quoted by media outlets including Kiplinger, Forbes, USA Today, Money Magazine, Huffington Post and more. Hannah is also author of the Infographic Resume and co-author of Social Networking for Business Success. I was surprised by some of the beliefs Hannah related in this episode that are no longer true when it comes to job searching and careers. Hannah also shares trends, tips, creative strategies and advice for those of us not only looking for a job, but those who may feel stuck in their current career. If you're looking for a one size fits all easy approach to changing your life, this is not the podcast for you. However, if you are delighted by tough questions, love hard and sometimes messy conversations then you are in the right place. I'm Linda Heeler, professional certified coach and host of the Normal Lies podcast. During my 10 years of coaching, I have helped dozens of people change their lives simply by questioning the beliefs they thought were true. Now it's your turn to uncover the normal lies in your life. Welcome, Hannah.

Hannah Morgan: 2:10

Good to be here. Linda. Thank you so much.

Linda Heeler: 2:12

I am so excited and the thing about it is we just met, we really just met What was it? Like, a month ago? Maybe

Hannah Morgan: 2:21

within the last month? For sure. Yeah,

Linda Heeler: 2:23

yeah. And so we met and then we had a one on one. And there was just something about you that I was I have to have her on the podcast?

Hannah Morgan: 2:33

Well, I felt the same way that there was a lot of stuff we had in common and just started our thoughts and ideas. We're on the same wavelength. So it was really I've loved meeting you. It's been great.

Linda Heeler: 2:42

Thank you. I did a little research on you. Because I didn't know that much about you. And you didn't know I was gonna do this. But what was funny was when we met when we met online, one of the things I shared with you because we're both business women too. And one of the things I shared with you is my woes about marketing, and especially social media marketing, what I didn't realize about you, number one, you've written two books, the one is the infographic resume. Correct. And then you co authored a book on social media for business success. You literally wrote the book on social media for business.

Hannah Morgan: 3:28

Well, I co authored it with a really talented woman. But yeah, we used our firsthand knowledge of growing our businesses using social media. So yeah, I did.

Linda Heeler: 3:37

Your advice was wonderful to begin with. And then to see that I thought that was really funny. I didn't realize also you have been a contributor for US News and World Report's on careers for a number of years. Yeah, that is really something. So I am very honored to have you here today. Thanks. So hopefully, we'll have some fun and share some information and share some of the things that aren't necessarily true anymore when it comes to the job search arena. But before we get started with that, I'm wondering if you would share a personal story of a belief or were calling them lies that you thought was absolutely true. And then you learned that it wasn't.

Hannah Morgan: 4:24

Yeah. And when we were talking a couple of weeks ago, three weeks ago, this is the story that I told. And I think that this was the turning point in my understanding of how the world of work works. Right. So I had been in college and I believe that the standard way that you got a job after college was to apply for a job online. That was what I believe my parents were away on a trip and my dad was was an executive headhunter. He placed people on Wall Street and some of the large financial institutions in New York City. And so while they were on vacation, I was checking the mail and my dad said, well, you just make sure that you get the important stuff out. So I call them one day and I said oh Pop, we've got a huge stack of letters and big envelopes. And it looks like you know, I opened a few of them though click like their letters and resumes. Do you want me to do anything with those? And he's like, No, you can use that for fire starter stuff said what he's like I already know all the people I need to know. And that was it. So all of these really talented professionals who had been sending their letters to my dad, who was a recruiter to try and get their foot in the door with a big financial institution or on Wall Street, we're wasting their time and energy because my dad made his business about building relationships. And he would seek out the best and the brightest, and have conversations with them and use that pool of people to find the people who was going to place that was my aha moment. Is that true today? Is that still true today? It is, it is more true today probably than it's ever been. So let me go back and say what's probably more true is that the power of a referral means more than your resume. So if you are just blindly applying for jobs online, hoping that you're really beautiful, talented resume convey is what you want it to, if somebody comes in line who has been referred by an employee, they're probably going to get interviewed before you doesn't mean that they'll get hired. But that decreases the chance that someone will ever look at your resume, the power of getting referred is critical to jumping the line and getting noticed. So I think that that's that's what I want people to know is that yeah, it feels good to apply online, it feels like you're doing something it feels productive. But when you look at the number of people who actually get hired solely because they applied for a job online, that number is in the 20% or less of all hires.

Linda Heeler: 6:41

So what do we do, if we don't know someone at this company, this great job comes up, we want to apply, but we don't know anybody is it even worth it to try and apply,

Hannah Morgan: 6:53

you can certainly always try to apply. But I always recommend the two step. And the two step can either be find in job, find an insider or find an insider find a job. So whatever that magical order is it it's not as important than what is important is that you take both steps. So if you find the Great job, go ahead and apply online, because you don't want to miss out on the opportunity, but at the same time, your job. And thank goodness for LinkedIn, LinkedIn wasn't a thing before you can find any employee inside any company right now and reach out to them. And you have to do your research on the individual and make sure that you can find something in common with them. But in looking at your background, I see that you made the move from finance to science, and I'm really interested in your career, I'd love to talk with you about how you got started at XYZ company. And oh, by the way, there's an opportunity there, I'd love to get your insight. So that is the outreach message. We know people are busy, and it doesn't mean that everybody is going to respond. But I think today more than ever, before people are aware of how weird this economy is and how challenging it is. So I think they're more likely to help today than they would have been pre pandemic. Here's the other thing I'll say about that outreach email, it should really be an email, most people don't live and breathe on LinkedIn. So if you're sending them that message just through LinkedIn, the chances of them seeing it fast are slim, right, because people don't check LinkedIn all the time. They maybe log in once a week. And they don't check that filter in their email that says, show me all the messages that have come across from LinkedIn, because that's not their life, their life is their work and their family. And that's where they email is where they go to see what's going on in their life in their family. So you can find people's email addresses, there's some tools out there that let you do that.

Linda Heeler: 8:36

Good advice. The other thing is, I'm imagining that job search has evolved over the years. And we are in a really different time right now in our country with the pandemic and everything else going on how has the beliefs of the past with job search changed to now or has it?

Hannah Morgan: 8:59

So there are a couple of things that aren't directly job search related, but are still impacting job seekers, which work to the jobseekers advantage. And in the olden days, if you had been out of work for three or more months, you were sort of seen as damaged goods, there was something wrong with you. But in today's environment, we know and recruiters know and HR know, hiring managers now that if you've been unemployed for the last 912 months, it's not because of you, they're not going to hold that against you, which is I mean, obviously some people still could write but that alone won't be the reason for rejecting you're looking at your application or your resume. So that's the really great thing that about the time that we're in now. And hopefully that will shift and carry through because we know really good people get let go all the time. And job search is hard. And so being unemployed for 3, 6, 9 months is not necessarily a reflection, a poor reflection of the individual but have something else going on altogether. So that makes one big change. But I think the other thing that online applications, we just have to know that that is a way it's not the only way and one of the things that people are saying The newest thing that come out and in Job Search trends is being proactive or targeting employers, I've been talking about targeting employers for 20 years. So it's not new for me, but it might be new to new people. The idea is you want to identify 2030, maybe 40 companies who could potentially hire you, these are companies that do interesting work that you would be interested in working for. They may be competitors. And then you systematically look for people in your network that you know who work there or know people who work there, and you build that relationship or that connection before there's a job posted. Because we know that a lot of the jobs are posted internally first, and may never get publicized publicly. So if you can have those inside conversations, you're much more likely to hear about the upcoming job or upcoming vacancy. So being proactive by targeting companies,

Linda Heeler: 10:51

Those are two really good things. What brings up the old saying is it's easier to get a job when you have a job, it was really frowned upon to have that gap at all, for any reason. And it's funny because I went on LinkedIn. And I saw that you had posted in comments that there was someone who said that employers understand now that maybe you have taken a couple of years off because of health reasons, because you decided to stay home with your child or you had a sick parent, and you had to take some time off. So I think it's really important for people to understand that we're breaking up that idea that it's not okay to take time for yourself, or to put that pressure on yourself to keep working.

Hannah Morgan: 11:45

That's so true. We only have one life, right. And I can't tell you how many sad stories I've heard people who waited to do what was important to them until they were tired. And then they had some ill bout of health and didn't get to do those things that they've been putting off until retirement. I think that we've learned this year, that if we don't do those things that are important to us now, who knows if we'll ever get to do them again, sometimes people call it work life balance. I don't know what we call it. But I think what you've said is making time for that stuff that is important to us shouldn't ever be used against us. And I think that we're becoming a more human and more humane and how we're looking at the reasons people decide to leave a job and be out of work for a period of time that are fully legitimate, right and should never be used against them.

Linda Heeler: 12:29

Yeah, definitely. The other point that I have noticed as being part of the Women's Network here, what I have noticed with some of the larger companies that we will have women who will come to us when the company is downsized, they always say to us, I wish I had started networking sooner because some of these companies have their own women's organizations within them. And so they network within the company. But then if the company downsizes, or they decide to leave, they have no outside network, what do you have to say about that?

Hannah Morgan: 13:07

It's hard to make the time to network. I'm an introvert. And I don't seek out opportunities to go to these networking events where I get together with a bunch of people that just don't like that. That's my excuse for not doing it. But I know it's important. So I find another way around that. So what I have done, because I believe it's so important to have outside perspectives, right? We need to be meeting new people with new ideas that are going to make us smarter and better. You don't have all the answers in our head. And our colleagues only think the same way we do. So we really need that outside perspective. I have this bucket list of people that I want to meet. Sometimes they're really famous people like Josh Burson was a guy I always wanted to meet. He's a big time HR consultant guy. And I've interviewed him once and I watch him whenever he speaks. So I feel like I sort of met him. But I have this bucket list of people that I want to meet. So before I can meet them, I have to sort of follow them and see what they're up to. And I usually know something about them. But that bucket list keeps me thinking, Oh, who else do I want to meet? And it gives me sort of an aspirational goal. Like, Oh, these are people that I want to meet I got to make, I've got to make that happen. Because there are people that I want to meet, not people that I have to meet. So I think everybody might have their own sort of bucket list. You know, maybe you've always wanted to meet the mayor of your town or you wanted to interact with some leader in an organization. There's nothing stopping you for reaching out and saying, Hey, I admire the work that you're doing. I'd love to talk with you more about how you did it. People are flattered.

Linda Heeler: 14:37

That's what I've noticed lately is with social media, it's so much easier to reach out and people are usually more open to it. Not all not all will be but again, this is about taking a risk and seeing if they're open to it. That's a great challenge. I hope everybody takes that challenge. Find someone that you would like to meet And just reach out to them if nothing more to let them know that they're having an impact on you. I think we all need that feedback. So I think that's a really great point. It's a really great point. And now the other thing I want to talk to you about is ageism. And when I hear the term ageism, I think of older folks, but ageism also applies to young people as well. Could you speak to that?

Hannah Morgan: 15:27

Yeah, it's really well, there are isms for everything, there's an ism for any group of people or any person out there. So ageism, on the younger end of the spectrum usually means this person doesn't have enough experience, they don't have the depth of knowledge. They're too young, they don't have enough life experience. On the other end of the spectrum, there's the old people who are 55 Plus, who are either overqualified for a job, they're asking for too much money, they have too much experience, and people perceive they would be bored in the job, their skills aren't fully up to date. So I think that, you know, we've got both of those ends of the spectrum, where people are falling victim to the pre judged conclusions of what somebody over 55 is and what somebody under 20 is, but neither of those are absolute. We know as an individual, we may not be anything at all, like our age group, because we hang with a different age group, we've had more experienced, but I think the first step to understanding the ISM is to really understand what's the negative connotation or the negative perception that people will be assuming or presuming about that age group. And then once you understand that, what can you do or say or write, that's going to position you so that you're not victim of that. So if you're somebody under 20, and they think people under 20, aren't going to stay with a job, they're not going to have the skills, they're not going to have the experience? Well, that's not true, right. So that individual who said, in college, I had three different co ops. And immediately after college, I got hired by that employer, and I've been working there ever since. So I technically I have five years of work experience, they just busted that bubble of that the younger people don't have enough work experience, that's not true. On the other end of the spectrum, if you're somebody who's 55 Plus, and people are concerned that you don't have the skills to do the job, then it's up to you to say, I just recently got my this certification and this technology, and I've been working on projects that are using this new fangled, whatever that newfangled software is right, you need to talk about that and show people that you have those skills, because at the end of the day, the employer wants somebody who's can come into the job as quickly as possible at the best price possible and do the job. So if the employer is thinking, you've got 40 years of work experience, you're going to be too expensive. They're right, unless you can prove to them that you say at this point in my life, making a large income is no longer a priority. For me, what's most important to me is the opportunity to give back and make a difference in the community. And that is why I'm interested in working for your not for profit.

Linda Heeler: 17:56

That's really great. And I hope it's okay that I keep mentioning that I was stalking you on social media. I'm looking at your posts, and some of the comments that you made on your posts were really great. You answered something, someone made a comment about ageism, and then you made a comment about is it really ageism? Or is it outdated are not up to date skills? Are they truly overqualified? Or too expensive? But you also added? Did they come across as condescending? I'm really interested in talking about that. Because with the younger folks, I'm thinking that they might come across as scared not confident in themselves. How much does mindset play when it comes into looking for a job?

Hannah Morgan: 18:47

Well, first of all, we're our own worst enemies. Because of what we think in our head, we either think that we're not qualified or we think we're overqualified, we determine our attitude. I am a believer in that we're all lifelong learners, nobody knows it all. And nobody knows more than me, the people that know less than me, but we all know, we all have the capacity to learn more. So if we go into an interview, saying things like, well, I've done this before, that's a no brainer, I could do that. with my eyes closed, I was successful in generating twice that amount of revenue in a shorter amount of time. And this would be easy for me to do, then you come across as arrogant and no one's gonna really want to work with you because you're gonna know all the answers and your answers may not be right in that company, but they were right in your last company. So I see people say over having overly confident and not being aware of their surroundings part of this job interview process is getting people to like us as much as anything else and believe in our skills. So if you come across as somebody who is a no at all, for overly confident those people in the workplace are difficult to work with. You can ask them to do something a different way because they're going to give you a hard time and just ask anybody who's worked for somebody who was a no at all. They didn't like it. I think that we have to really pay more attention to those soft skills. And the relationship building, not just the How can I let them know I'm confident and capable of doing this job because being competent and capable is certainly part of it. But I don't want somebody being so overbearing and and aggressively confident that they're not going to be fun to work with. I don't want to hire somebody like that. On the other end of the spectrum, those people that are younger that need more experience, everyone knows you need more experience. That's why you're looking for this lower level job. So talk about the times you've learned things quickly, and you've come up to speed quickly in learning that you've overcome challenges and not knowing all the answers. That's what they want to hear like, Okay, if I bring you in, and you don't have all the skills, are you going to be easy to manage? Or am I gonna have to watch you every single minute of every day to make sure you're doing what you need to do to come up to speed? So I think that on both ends of the spectrum, we just have to remember what is the biggest concern in the hiring managers eyes before they hire us? If we're young and inexperienced, and it's a lack of experience? What can you do to prove to them that your lack of experience is not really a problem? And I don't think that's an easy answer. But at least showing that you're aware that you realize that's an area that you need improvement in and that looking back, it would have been great if you would realize that you needed an internship that that really would have helped you. But that's water under the bridge. Now, the best you can say is I learned my lesson that I should have been taking an internship while I was in college, it would have given me the experience. But what I did learn this that I can work twice as hard as anybody else and come up to speed faster in this kind of a role.

Linda Heeler: 21:26

This episode of the Normal Lies podcast is brought to you by Live Inspired Life Coaching. What if you could create your unique roadmap to success? Learn strategies that foster deeper, more meaningful relationships? What if you discovered your life purpose and woke up every morning excited for the day ahead? It is possible. I'm Linda Heeler, host of the Normal Lies podcast and owner of Live Inspired Life Coaching. I'm a professional certified coach with 10 years of coaching experience, I have a proven system that helps my clients boost their careers, enhance their relationships, find their purpose and get excited about life. Want to know more? Contact me for a free 30 minute discovery session at 585-210-8726. or email Linda at Live Inspired life coaching.com I think for the for the younger folks, volunteering can also help I know that a lot of colleges look at what they're doing. So you know, we want to know what have you been doing to give back to your community? So I think that they have to look at that. What did they do? They can be strategic about it? What are they going into? Where can they start to build those skills, right? Even from volunteer position?

Hannah Morgan: 22:55

There are so many clubs, you're so right, Linda, in college, there are so many clubs and organizations that you can be a part of it. You could even be that house leader. There are a lot of special interest houses, right? There's so many different ways that somebody who wants to develop experience skills knowledge in college could do that outside of the classroom, take on that Secretary role to learn how to organize and orchestrate events take on that financial accounting role in the in the club so that you can track the numbers because it's going to work well for your finance. Absolutely.

Linda Heeler: 23:26

And for the older generation, that's got to be tough to be out looking for a job at an older age, especially if you thought that you had a career and you were gonna stay in a place because in my generation and older we come from Rochester, Kodak Xerox, I know a lot of people who they went there and that was it. They were done. I mean, they retired from there. And it was like one and done. That's not the case anymore.

Hannah Morgan: 23:57

So if this is the message that I want to get out to every employee or any worker that's going to be working today, your job, no matter what company you work for, will not last forever. I wish I knew what the stats were. But I think it's like one and 50 it's almost 50% of the people have at some point in their career been laid off, everybody should be prepared for a layoff because that is the new reality of the world that we live in. And the other reality is that most people will have three to five different careers over the course of their lifetime, which is great, because many people didn't like what they were doing to begin with how many people who retired from Xerox, Kodak, did you talk to him? They're like, Oh, thank god that's over, like, Well, why did you do it for so long? If you didn't love it, we should like what we do. And if we don't like what we do, then we should figure out a way to be happy because again, our life is short and we want to make sure we're making full use of it. It shouldn't be shocking, but it is that people are being laid off later in life. No job will last forever. I want people to know that it can happen tomorrow to any of us. There's a secret though. There was a guy I knew who actually had a side hustle. And he was later in life. He was just counting down the years until he retired. But he started while he was working in his job. He had enough flexibility. He started the side gig buying and refurbishing slot machines that he sold online, but he would buy these slot machines from I think they were vendors in China or somewhere overseas, and he would refurbish them, he wouldn't personally he would have them refurbish, and then he would resell them online. And he'd make, I don't know, 150 $200 per slot machine. And if he sold enough of those in a month, he had a nice little chunk of change. He did that before he was retired. And then one day he was laid off, and then guess what he did with his slot machine refurbishing business, he kicked it into high gear, and so he was processing way more and making more money. And so there wasn't that problem for him about what am I going to do now I don't have a job. He then said, Oh, I can just turn up notch up my slot machine business, the moral to that story is always have a side gig that you can notch up or notch back depending on where you are and what kind of energy you have.

Linda Heeler: 26:03

I love that because again, the old rules, the old lies work, you have to suffer, just get the job. And as long as you have that job, you just stay at it that pays well. What I'm learning, again, is from the younger generation, which I love is no we don't have to suffer and slog through our life, we deserve to be happy. Now that's not to say that we quit our job and go willy nilly, but we can make plans.

Hannah Morgan: 26:33

Taking that one job, one company route is not the only way to make a living today, it's so much more empowering to know that I have control over my income versus being at the whim and mercy of an employer. Employers are getting better because of the pandemic and giving us more free time. Right and not being you know, requiring us to come into the office, this, this has been great, because we do have that freedom. I don't know if we will always have that. But I think we've broken the dam. And I think we're gonna see more companies say, Okay, this is working out when we give employees their freedom. And we're not watching them like a hawk, they seem to be doing more and doing better. So let's keep doing that. That means that we have more flexibility to take on those extra side projects, or those other things that fulfill us maybe it's even volunteering, oftentimes, just that volunteering can make your life more fulfilling than your job alone.

Linda Heeler: 27:23

We've kind of looked out ahead. Do you have any other predictions for the job market ahead? What's your best advice in people contemplating a new job or a new career

Hannah Morgan: 27:34

right now. And we're still going to be looking at this for a while. And I don't come up with these ideas on my own. I'm reading a lot of what they're saying and the trade journals and things like that. But one of the things that we know is remote work, working remotely is not going away. That means that if you find this really great job, and it's remote, and Tennessee, you can work that job. So we now have expanded our territory of where we can look for great job, we're not married to our own geographic location. And yes, not all jobs are going to remain remote. Some may be called back to the office. But that's certainly something that you can cross that bridge when you come to it right now, if that job is virtual, and you can work remotely and you can get your foot in the door with a great company that you've always wanted to work for that's doing great things. Why not look at that. So I think that that remote work is something that's not going to go away, it's going to shift, it's taught that the companies might go more hybrid and give the opportunity to some people to come in and others not. But they still have to operate really well as a remote team and make that work. That just means that maybe this five day workweek thing is stupid, too. Why do we need a five day workweek who said that we had to work eight to five, there are certain roles where that's required. And I get that but for a lot of other jobs. That's that's not real. So that gives parents and caretakers greater flexibility with how they structure the work that they do. So I think there are all kinds of really good things that aren't going to go away. Just because we have gone past the pandemic, the thing that people worry about is the salaries and the inequity and salaries in New York and California. You know, those those states pay really well, there is going to be some leveling of that. And so even though you may be living in a rural part of Kansas, but if you take a job in California in New York City, you're not going to make the full New York City pay, you'll make whatever that company has decided the standard wage nationally is for that role. We'll see that happen. It hasn't happened yet. But companies are working on that now.

Linda Heeler: 29:31

That's so great. I did an interview with someone and we kind of got into this conversation about the paid family leave and how the United States has been so work oriented, that it's almost looked down upon, if even if we were to have the government say yes, you can take three months of paid family leave that my guest said you know, I wonder if anyone would take it and those people who did take it well would likely be looked down upon, I think there's definitely more work to do here

Hannah Morgan: 30:05

is and we can always look to the younger generation to help move this forward. It's the Gen X about the Gen Z really who've helped, because they're such a big portion of our population, and they're in the workforce. Now. They're really helping drive some of these changes for more flexible work schedules and, and valuing that time off and taking vacation. So they're pushing, and we're starting to see some things change. So I hope that we all can find a healthier way to manage this work culture, because what we're doing now is not

Linda Heeler: 30:36

it's not, no, it's not healthy, it's not sustainable. And I think we've proven through this pandemic, we can get creative, we can get creative and how to do this and still produce. In fact, I just saw on LinkedIn, the Harvard Business Review said that happy employees are more productive employees. And so I think we really need to go down this road, I think we really do.

Hannah Morgan: 31:01

And the other thing, there were stats, I can't remember who said this, but many researchers have done research over the course of the pandemic to look at productivity levels and productivity levels did not dip at all during the pandemic, as a matter of fact, they increased. So here we have people who are locked up in their homes in less than ideal working conditions, because their kids are screaming in the background or whatever. And we're all under the stress of this pandemic and what it means. And yet those employees still outperformed what they normally would have done. Had they been in the office. Yeah, just

Linda Heeler: 31:30

says a lot. It does. So again, I think creativity ingenuity, that's what we're all about here in the US. So I think we continue the conversation and see what we can create next. And I think as an older generation, I think we need to be open to those ideas. Because I'm telling you, my kids have opened my eyes to a lot of things that I thought were absolutely true. And I'm finding out. No, because our kids are the younger generation, they're questioning it. And instead of saying you shouldn't question you just need to go along. I think we need to go Oh, yeah, I'm wondering why we still do it that way too. Is there a better way? Right?

Hannah Morgan: 32:10

Ever better

Linda Heeler: 32:11

Yeah. Before I have some wrap up questions for you. Tell us number one, how can we get your books?

Hannah Morgan: 32:18

Actually, both of my books are available on Amazon, the infographic resume is on Amazon. And I'm pretty sure that the other one small business success, social media for small business success is also available on Amazon.

Linda Heeler: 32:30

Okay, cool. Can you just tell me because I'm really curious, that Infographic Resume? Can you just give me a little idea? What does that mean? And what will people get from that book?

Hannah Morgan: 32:41

It's a really cool thing that happens when the marketplace is tight. In other words, there are a lot of people looking for jobs and you're trying to stand out is that you need to find more creative, unusual ways to stand out from the other people who are just sending a standard resume. The thing about the infographic resume is that it takes well an infographic takes data, complex information, puts it into picture. So imagine taking some of the information from your resume and converting that into pictures, images, icons, graphs, charts, it's an alternative way of representing your skill sets, it actually will not work well with online applications. So don't try to submit it. But it's perfect for your LinkedIn profile. It's great for networking, and it's a great tool to bring to an interview or send to an interviewer because they're going to be wowed. So we've seen infographics, we see them all the time. And in the US News and World Report. I think they were the first ones. But I mean, they're just fun ways of representing your skills. Instead of using the company name, use the icon or the logo for the company, just little things like that. Because the idea is you have fewer words and more pictures, more representation.

Linda Heeler: 33:48

So it's basically just a picture and it's just information in a picture. I think that's awesome for especially for people who are more creative.

Hannah Morgan: 33:58

Absolutely graphic designers really should be looking at that it's a great sample of their work and their logic and their creativity. Anybody in advertising or any kind of creative role. Those really work well to show that you're sort of an out of the box creative thinker.

Linda Heeler: 34:14

And for me who would struggle with that, I wonder if there's a market for maybe a graphic designer for me to just say, Hey, here's my information. Can you put this in an infographic so there maybe there's a market for that.

Hannah Morgan: 34:26

There are people who do that.

Linda Heeler: 34:28

Are there really? That is so awesome. Yeah. Oh, see, I love these conversations. I learned something new every time. That's so awesome. All right. Also, Hannah, how can people connect with you?

Hannah Morgan: 34:42

So I have a website at CareerSherpa.net and areer sh er pa dotnet. But I'm ctive on LinkedIn, Hannah Morg n, I'm active on Twitter and acebook and Instagram. So I'm ll over social media and you an connect with me and any of T ose places just say hi, I hear you on Linda's show

Linda Heeler: 35:03

And I will put links to your website and to your social media in the show notes so that people can can connect with you. So now we're going to do our wrap up questions. All right, complete these sentences. The most important thing I learned or best piece of advice I received when I was younger was...

Hannah Morgan: 35:24

...know what companies you want to work for. So people can help introduce you.

Linda Heeler: 35:28

Nice. Okay, one lie that I wish I discovered sooner is...

Hannah Morgan: 35:33

...the company doesn't own you.

Linda Heeler: 35:35

The thing that makes me authentically me is...

Hannah Morgan: 35:39

...giving people hope. This was the question that was the hardest one for me to realize. I had to think a long time, like what is authentically me? So that is it, giving people hope.

Linda Heeler: 35:49

Giving people hope, that's awesome. And if I had a magic wand that would make everyone in the world believe one thing it would be...

Hannah Morgan: 35:59

...you have everything you need to be successful in life right now today as you are.

Linda Heeler: 36:06

I think that's a great place to leave that. That's awesome. Hannah Morgan, thank you so much for being here today. And I look forward to getting to know you even more and connecting in the future. Thank you.

Hannah Morgan: 36:19

Thank you, Linda.

Linda Heeler: 36:20

This interview was full of great information. I love Hannah's advice about making a list of companies you'd like to work for, and then doing some research to see if you know anyone who works there. Linked In is a great resource for that. Remember that networking is about building relationships. It's not just about getting it's also about giving. If you are looking for an introduction or a favor, be sure to ask what you can do to help them I was surprised a bit to hear Hannah say that your job will not last forever be prepared to be laid off, which leads to have a side gig that you can notch up or notchback depending on your circumstances. Hannah also pointed out the importance of soft skills according to indeed calm soft skills or personal habits and traits that shape how you work on your own and with others. These include effective communication, teamwork, creativity, problem solving, adaptability, willingness to learn and empathy. While you can go back to school to develop your hard skills, your technical knowledge or training, if you really want to get ahead these days, consider working on your soft skills coaching can definitely help with those soft skills so reach out if you'd like to talk about how you can become more productive, successful and happier in your career. Be sure to subscribe, rate and leave a review. I'd love to hear your thoughts regarding this episode so please leave a comment or a question in your review or you can email Linda at normal dash lies.com. Until next time, make it a great day.